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Brayu

Student
Sep 14, 2021
129
So... I'm 23 years old. I have some fear of getting old (as I've heard many here)... It's not just because of the appearance or health in my particular case, but because of the temporal distance between where I am and death (unless something unforeseen occurs before and I hope that occur...) and indeed the affliction of the health of someone who has gone before and makes me feel more alone...

But what I realize is that our Western societies also make old age very difficult, because being old in our context is basically being discarded (just as we neurodivers and the disabled are already young). People in a capitalist society only serve if the richest are useful, which means that if you don't have a lot of money your old age will be hell!

In a society with traditional models, like that of Ghana (I quote Ghana because I'm more familiar, but we can apply Africa and Oceania to a large extent), old age is very well regarded and even desired, as it literally nobility. An elder within the Ghana chiefdom institution is usually the eldest in each household (there are variables), having not only respect but an important social role and assisting in community decisions (almost like a local parliament for each chiefdom). Unfortunately, the Western model of society denies old age an entirely passive role of waiting for death (being re-accepted or even having a decent retirement does not change the root of the problem).

That's why I end up interpreting that Africa, no matter how underdeveloped (each country at a different level) has much healthier social relationships in general, reserving a place for everyone (within the community). Perhaps it also lowers the incidence of suicide there (unlike some pro-lives who romanticize poverty and the "struggle for survival").
 
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whywere

Enlightened
Jun 26, 2020
1,460
Spot on, as I am 65, reference for this post only, and I got laid off after 29.5 years and I like to work as it keeps my mind busy, BUT all I have run into is 100% age discrimination. I had an interview last week where all were in their 20 somethings with mohawks, scraggly beards and some looked like they had not seen a shower in a long time and I got an email the next day saying no thanks. I have over 40 years of business experience and one of the interviewers had 3 months experience. Since being laid off this is what I run into all the time.

I NEVER EVER could care less about age, gender, heck anything, but here in the U.S., since I am 65, "over the hill", I face this each and every day. I guess having gray hair and wrinkles is like a horrible disease.

Walter
 
stalewater

stalewater

Experienced
Jul 11, 2021
282
Spot on, as I am 65, reference for this post only, and I got laid off after 29.5 years and I like to work as it keeps my mind busy, BUT all I have run into is 100% age discrimination. I had an interview last week where all were in their 20 somethings with mohawks, scraggly beards and some looked like they had not seen a shower in a long time and I got an email the next day saying no thanks. I have over 40 years of business experience and one of the interviewers had 3 months experience. Since being laid off this is what I run into all the time.

I NEVER EVER could care less about age, gender, heck anything, but here in the U.S., since I am 65, "over the hill", I face this each and every day. I guess having gray hair and wrinkles is like a horrible disease.

Walter
I never understood discrimination against older people. Does people hate their future selves?
 
SoyMedusa

SoyMedusa

I am the Crone.
Sep 28, 2021
150
Your post is sadly true. I am 57 and today is my husband's 70th Birthday. We have a small amount of savings, but nothing near what we'd need to survive for however long that is. He's planning on applying for a part-time job at our local co-op to supplement our savings. But how long can he do that? Work?

I am younger, but too ill and too crazy to work... maybe. I keep thinking about things I can do from home that would let me use spoons when I have them.

Anyway, sorry I drifted off there. Yeah, getting old is a thing, but I don't see why it should affect your decision about ctb because you can do that at any time along the span of your life.
 
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blueclover_.

blueclover_.

Better Never to Have Been: 2006, David Benatar
Oct 11, 2021
377
I never understood discrimination against older people. Does people hate their future selves?
Even though i'm not siding with the evil corporations, i see the logic behind that. It's not personal. Let's try to look at it from a business standpoint.

All they care about is profit. They need efficient workers and oftentimes old people can not provide that. So when an old person still has a good work performance, they get overlooked because of their peers. Those companies simply want profits, and that's the truth of capitalism.
 
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Brayu

Student
Sep 14, 2021
129
But that's the question... If you're not useful to capital in a Western society you tend to be marginalized (and this resonates with everything else)

It would be similar to not having the protection of the feudal lord in the middle ages.

When I quote African and Oceanian societies, it is exactly that... they adopt a capitalist system, but the traditional base systems end up delegating to the "old" comfortable social positions (of authority, of participation...). I particularly like to study what were the African empires and kingdoms (and what is left of them, the chiefdoms and "traditional states") and so if what I am talking about.

Here in the West, our value as a person depends only on being economically active or having enough money to play these dirty games (some old and sick people do, but the minority...)

Sometimes I think... who would say that the order of the contemporary era (after the French Revolution) could have some defect, even with all "freedom".

I hate how sick our social relationships are!
Even though i'm not siding with the evil corporations, i see the logic behind that. It's not personal. Let's try to look at it from a business standpoint.

All they care about is profit. They need efficient workers and oftentimes old people can not provide that. So when an old person still has a good work performance, they get overlooked because of their peers. Those companies simply want profits, and that's the truth of capitalism.
Your post is sadly true. I am 57 and today is my husband's 70th Birthday. We have a small amount of savings, but nothing near what we'd need to survive for however long that is. He's planning on applying for a part-time job at our local co-op to supplement our savings. But how long can he do that? Work?

I am younger, but too ill and too crazy to work... maybe. I keep thinking about things I can do from home that would let me use spoons when I have them.

Anyway, sorry I drifted off there. Yeah, getting old is a thing, but I don't see why it should affect your decision about ctb because you can do that at any time along the span of your life.
Anguish and fear of the future (uncertain and often limiting, physical limitations are normal, social limitations shouldn't) make people want CTB even more.
 
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stalewater

stalewater

Experienced
Jul 11, 2021
282
Even though i'm not siding with the evil corporations, i see the logic behind that. It's not personal. Let's try to look at it from a business standpoint.

All they care about is profit. They need efficient workers and oftentimes old people can not provide that. So when an old person still has a good work performance, they get overlooked because of their peers. Those companies simply want profits, and that's the truth of capitalism.
Still,, that doesn't explain discrimination even at social situations, but I understand the logic.
What the companies are overlooking is that wisdom and experience can be very well used in work, but all they want are people to do repetitive and heavy tasks, like cheap robots
 
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